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Episode 96: Exploring Rachel Carson’s Life and The Divestment Movement

Local chapter of Fossil Free Movement at Northern Arizona University

Episode 96: Exploring Rachel Carson’s Life and The Divestment Movement

In this episode of Citizens’ Climate Radio, hosts Horace Mo and Erica Valdez bring together diverse voices to discuss current efforts to address climate change. Horace Mo speaks with Ann E. Burg, a celebrated author known for compelling historical novels for young readers, about her newly published novel, “Force of Nature–A Novel of Rachel Carson, which opens a new door for readers to experience the life of Carson, a well-known environmental pioneer in the U.S., by reading her field notes and Ann’s innovative writing.

Erica Valdez discusses the American fossil fuel divestment movement, highlighting the work of younger generations. She has a conversation with Aly Horton, another student taking the initiative to promote the fossil fuel divestment movement on their campus at Northern Arizona University.

In the Resilience Corner, Tamara Staton speaks on mastering the banjo and how this uniquely relates to addressing climate change. Finally, we have a Good News story from Peterson Toscano regarding South Africa’s energy supply.

Ann E. Burg Explores Rachel Carson’s Life

In this episode, author Ann E. Burg dives into her latest work, “Force of Nature.” This novel is inspired by Rachel Carson’s groundbreaking environmental book Silent Spring. It is beautifully illustrated by Sophie Blackall.

After World War II, DDT became a common pesticide in neighborhoods and farms; however, it had dire consequences for ecosystems, entering the food chain and harming various species. This alarming situation inspired Rachel Carson to write and publish her now-famous book, “Silent Spring”, in 1962. Ann E Burg tells us how Carson’s book “explored DDT but also started with a fable for tomorrow. It suggested what life would be like if spring came and no birds were there to sing.”

Ann E. Burg considers Rachel Carson a role model for her scientific rigor and environmental advocacy. Carson’s ability to illuminate the beauty and complexity of nature-inspired Burg to see the world differently. This novel, “Force of Nature,” is not merely a recounting of Carson’s life but an immersive experience of her world. Burg hopes readers will see the world through Carson’s eyes and appreciate the interconnectedness of all life.

About Ann E. Burg

Ann Burg

Ann E. Burg’s debut novel, “All the Broken Pieces,” was named an ALA Best Book for Young Adults, a Jefferson Cup award winner, and an IRA Notable Book for a Global Society, among its many honors. Her subsequent novels in verse have garnered multiple awards and starred reviews. “Serafina’s Promise” was named an ALA Notable, a Parents’ Choice Gold Award Winner, and an NAACP Image Award finalist.Unbound won the New York Historical Society Children’s History Book Prize, the Christopher Award, and an Arnold Adoff Poetry Honor. “Flooded–A Requiem for Johnstown” was a Bank Street College Claudia Lewis Award winner, a Bank Street College Best Children’s Book (with outstanding merit), and a Junior Library Guild selection. Before becoming a full-time writer, Burg worked as an English teacher for ten years. She lives in Rhinebeck, New York, with her family. To learn more about Ann E. Burg, visit her online at

The Student-Led Drive for Fossil Fuel Divestment

Erica Valdez discusses the fossil fuel divestment movement, highlighting the efforts on her campus, Northern Arizona University (NAU). Climate change is a human-caused phenomenon in which the fossil fuel industry plays a significant role. Erica dives into what divestment is and how it may be one of the most effective steps that institutions can take to slow climate change.

Erica invites Aly Horton, president of Fossil Free NAU, a student-led group demanding complete divestment. Aly explains the club’s efforts and goals to hold the university accountable to its environmental commitments. 

Aly and Erica also discuss recent pushback from the university administration. Nevertheless, Fossil Free NAU remains determined to continue its mission because it is just a small chapter of an international movement. Although it may be difficult, many institutions have already divested from fossil fuels. Aly shares inspiring advice to organizers worldwide who are working towards divestment.

Listen Now!

Resilience Corner

For this month’s Resilience Corner, Tamara Staton draws parallels between her desire to master the banjo and the overwhelming task of addressing climate change. When practicing banjo, she faces common emotional barriers like fear, perfectionism, imposter syndrome, and information overload. We also face these barriers when we talk about climate change. Tamara discusses why it is important to recognize these feelings, encouraging listeners to embrace imperfections and persistent efforts.

To learn more about building resilience in the face of climate challenges, visit the Resilience Hub. You can also email Tamara at radio @ or text or leave a message at 619-512-9646.

Good News!

Peterson Toscano shares a good news story from Limpopo Province, South Africa, where earlier this month he was staying in a game reserve. He reflects on the progress in South Africa’s energy sector since his previous stay, highlighting the severe scheduled power outages known as load-shedding issues caused by unreliable coal-powered plants. He notes that significant changes have occurred since President Cyril Ramaphosa raised the licensing threshold for private power generation, leading to over 1,000 registered renewable energy projects. These projects, primarily solar and wind, are now providing nearly 4,500 megawatts of new capacity, significantly reducing power outages and transforming the country’s energy landscape.

Take a Meaningful Next Step

Each month, we will suggest meaningful, achievable, and measurable next steps for you to consider. We recognize that action is an antidote to despair. If you are struggling with what you can do, visit our Action Page.

Listener Survey

We want to hear your feedback about this episode. After you listen, feel free to fill in this short survey. Your feedback will help us make new decisions about the show’s content, guests, and style. You can fill it out anonymously and answer whichever questions you like. You can also reach us by email:  

Special Thanks to the following people and groups for the ways they promote us through social media: Robert D. Evans, Pete Marsh, Bill Nash, 1.5, EG Hibdon, Mats Söderlund, Justin D’Atri, and last month’s guest, Rob Hopkins.Earthbased.Soul, FCWC, CCL Alameda, Alaska, and the CCL Young Conservative Caucus. 

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Production Team:

  • Written and produced by Horace Mo, Erica Valdez, with assistance from Peterson Toscano.
  • Technical Support: Ricky Bradley, and Brett Cease.
  • Social Media Assistance: Flannery Winchester.

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Read the Transcript

Episode 96: Exploring Rachel Carson’s Life and Our New Divestment Story



Erica Valdez, Horace Mo, Peterson Toscano, Aly Horton, Ann E Burg, Tamara Staton, 

Horace Mo  00:02

Welcome to Citizens Climate Radio, your climate change podcast.

Erica Valdez  00:08

In the show, we highlight people’s stories, we celebrate your successes. And together we share strategies for talking about climate change.

Horace Mo  00:15

I am your co-host, Horace Mo.

Erica Valdez  00:18

 And I’m your other co-host, Erica Valdez. 

Horace Mo  00:21

Welcome to Episode 96 of Citizens Climate Radio, a project of Citizens Climate Education.

Erica Valdez  00:28

This episode is airing on Friday, June 28th 2024. Okay, listeners, so this is a very new setup that we’re used to.

Horace Mo  00:39

Yeah we’re both excited because we have completely written, produced, and our hosting this miles episode by ourselves.

Erica Valdez  00:49

Yeah, which is very different, but I’m super excited for it. We have a lot of great things in this episode, Horace. What are you most excited for?

Horace Mo  00:56

Oh wow. I mean, we just have so much great conten covering this episode. But you asked me that question, which one I’m most excited about. It’s going to be my interview with Ann E Berg. The interview is about any Berg’s book, Force of Nature. 

Erica Valdez  01:12

Yeah, it’s a great story. I’m really excited to hear it.

Horace Mo  01:14

As usual, you’ll hear from Tamar Staten, who is the host of Resilience Corner. 

Erica Valdez  01:20

To finish off today’s episode, I also brought a story about fossil fuel divestment, and how students are organizing and empowering themselves to get their university to divest. Coincidently, I talk a little bit about my group that I was involved in on my university campus, so stay tuned for that. I’m

Horace Mo  01:37

I’m on the same side with you Erica. Go divestment. So stay tuned for Erica’s port. 

Horace Mo  01:47

When you hear a book named Silent Spring, who and what we think of right off the bat? For many the image of Rachel Carson will spontaneously pop up in your mind, right? However, we’re not only talking about Silent Spring or the life of Rachel Carson today. Instead, on today’s show, we have a special guest Ann E Berg. She’s a celebrated author known for her compelling historical novels for young readers. Her work explores themes of resilience, just as in the human spirit, making her a beloved voice in children’s literature. I met with Anne to talk about her recently published book Force of Nature. It is a verse novel that presents Rachel Carson’s view of the world and nature. Ann told me about DDT and how its effects inspired Rachel Carson to publish one of the most recognized environmental books Silent Spring.

Ann E Burg  02:56

During World War Two, there was a pesticide known as DDT that was used by the military to keep disease from spreading, that when the war was over. They brought that pesticide to neighborhoods and backyard gardens to get rid of bugs and to get rid of the pests in the farms. The use was so prevalent they were crazy using DDT. What they didn’t realize was that DDT sinks into the soil and lives under the soil. Soon it became part of our food chain, and that meant the worms were digesting it. And soon then the birds were digesting it. And soon, just about when Rachel was starting to think about her book, birds were falling from their nests with their claws splayed. Fish were dying, and it occurred to Rachel that if we didn’t get a grip on this, these species wouldn’t be the only ones to suffer from DDT. She wrote a book called Silent Spring which examines the effect of DDT on life, on nature. The book explained all of that explored DDT, but also started with a fable for tomorrow it suggested, what would life be like if spring came and no birds were there to sing?

Horace Mo  04:25

While the Silent Spring reveals nature’s woes and alerts people to stop using DDT and says she had a different purpose, right a Force of Nature. She wants to allow the audience to experience Rachel’s world through her eyes.

Ann E Burg  04:43

The beauty of Rachel Carson was that she didn’t see us as separate from nature. She sees people, humans, humankind as a part of nature.

Ann E Burg  05:00

Of course, she was sorry to leave the world. She looked to nature and saw that everything leaves the world and comes back in another way that gave her hope. She found her place in nature, she does still live on in her words, and in her thoughts and in the love she had for our planet. In Force of Nature, we’re not reading about Rachel Carson. We’re not learning that she grew up in Pennsylvania, this was the day in 1907. We’re not learning that. We are not learning about her. And we’re not learning about her world. We are experiencing her world. It was my way of experiencing the world through Rachel’s eyes, and through her experiences. And in this case, I wanted to say that here was an amazing person that grew up in his sheltered life and went on to change the world.

Horace Mo  06:05

After researching and knowing about Rachel Carson, Ann shared the deep impression that Rachel’s life and the work have left on her as a person, and as a writer,

Ann E Burg  06:15

She is a role model. I mean, she’s a scientist, she’s a writer, she’s an environmentalist, but most of all, she’s a role model for all of us to live our lives that way, and maybe to see the world that way. And maybe if we did see the world that way, we would treat nature and all of her creatures more kindly. 

Ann E Burg  06:35

When I looked at life, that way, you see a puddle and you see a puddle, but there’s life teeming in that puddle. It’s like she lit a light in my mind. As beautiful as things are, we don’t know half of how beautiful things are, how beautiful things are in ways that we don’t see. In that way. She awakened something in me that had never existed before. I mean, I didn’t really think of that ever. I didn’t like biology, I didn’t like learning about frogs. There is nothing about that. That appealed to me. But when I saw it through her eyes, the fascination and also the connection she had that we are all connected, she’s changed how I see the world.

Horace Mo  07:22

Lastly, Ann generously read a small section for book to give us a sneak peek of a book and the lubricin optimistic and the inspiring message to the world.

Ann E Burg  07:35

A drop of pond water holds within it an unseen universe teeming with life microscopic creatures, water fleas, water worms and all types of larvae squiggled through the silky threads of underwater plants. There is so much to see and learn.

Ann E Burg  08:01

I would like to tell the whole world that we are lucky to live on such a beautiful place. It is imperative that each of us recognize we’re part of this world. We should take good care of it stop fighting and take care of beautiful planet.

Horace Mo  08:22

That was Ann E Burg reading from her novel Force of Nature. And he’s available wherever you get books, Angel reading force of nature, and I highly recommend you to get a copy of it. You will experience the mystery of nature’s Rachel Carson’s eyes. Learn more about Ann and her other books by visiting her website 

Erica Valdez  09:11

Now I’m going to share a story of how students on university campuses are working towards a fossil free future. We know that climate change is a human-caused phenomenon, and that the effects are being felt by communities all over the world. We also hear about an infamous contributor to climate change the fossil fuel industry; although they’re known to be very harmful to the environment, fossil fuels have become a huge part of our lives. It’s not practical for every person to boycott fossil fuels, but there are other ways that we can become less reliant on them. One of these is complete divestment from fossil fuels.

Erica Valdez  09:48

So what is divestment? Simply put, divestment is the opposite of investment. Imagine you have money invested in companies like Shell, Exxon Mobil or Chevron, but you decide you don’t want to invest in them anymore. So you sell your stocks or assets. These companies profit by exploiting natural resources and accelerating climate change. So this movement calls for simply removing yourself as a shareholder in fossil fuel companies and companies that are fossil fuel intensive. Students and Northern Arizona University or any you are organizing and working towards a fossil-free future. Leading the initiative is a club called Fossil Free NAU or FFNAU. This chapter is just a small part of an international divestment movement. I decided to invite my good friend and president of Fossil Free NAU Aly Horton to talk more about the initiative.

Aly Horton  10:50

Fossil Free NEU has been around for several years back in 2014 is when there was the initial movement, which phased out a little bit and has on and off flourished throughout the time at NAU, but within the past two to three years that has been when the movement has really taken off and started to flourish to what it is today.

Erica Valdez  11:14

Ali also explains how and why FFNAU is holding the university accountable, and what actions were taking like drafting a letter to the board of the demands, and getting signatures from the students, staff, faculty and alumni.

Aly Horton  11:27

Fossil Free NAU’s demands of divestment would encourage any you to align their actions with their commitments, especially with their elevating excellence strategy, which includes the effective utilization of our financial resources with an emphasis and environmental stewardship. So with this, we are just encouraging them to actually commit to those commitments and follow through with their actions. Our demands to the NAU Foundation Board include the divestment from the top 200 coal, oil and gas reserve owners evaluate all carbon intensive companies for the existence and quality of a low-carbon transition plan. gather feedback from any use students, faculty, alumni and staff on priorities for socially responsible investment policy. And lastly, disclose endowment holdings and investment policy annually.

Erica Valdez  12:18

Unfortunately, there are also people who are fighting against these efforts this semester as a venue has faced some pushback from powerful administration. I told us a little bit about some recent events.

Aly Horton  12:29

In February Fossil Free NAU began strategizing who we wanted to reach out to to gain support on our letter to the NAU Foundation Board, we decided to reach out to the Faculty Senate of NAU. We had met with them initially in March for about 10 minutes, which resulted in them requesting for us to come back to further our discussion. We came back in April to discuss the letter again with the faculty members and the senators. However, we weren’t given an opportunity really to speak at this engagement they had allotted only 15 to 25 minutes initially on the agenda. However, they allowed the conversation to go over 35 minutes, but unfortunately the first 15 of that was taken by a representative from the NLU Foundation Board, which was unfortunate for us in our time and our voice as students. We were not given time to speak at this event. 

Aly Horton  13:28

This event resulted in the Faculty Senate deciding to not sign on to our letter so we began strategizing what we wanted to do. We met later that night after the faculty senate meeting to discuss our actions which resulted in us writing a response to the faculty senate and began organizing to contact the NTU Foundation Board and Investment Committee. We’re hoping that they follow through with their open door policy that they said in that meeting and begin this conversation with us.

Erica Valdez  13:59

The signature would have been a great addition to the letter, but FFNAU is pushing through this challenge and continuing our mission to present the letter to the foundation board and then your future. FFNEU is an example of how groups are taking huge strides towards a fossil free future. 

Erica Valdez  14:15

Complete fossil fuel divestment is a very difficult thing to accomplish in higher education or any institution. We may always rely on fossil fuels. But this group, along with countless others show the progress we’re making to become less reliant on them. 1000s of institutions have already divested over $40 trillion. Talk about progress. And in recent years, other universities have demanded for divestment as well, including New York, Boston, Cornell, Harvard, and the whole California State and University of California systems. For those starting divestment movements are facing similar struggles as FF NAU ally shares great advice about how we can keep moving forward and why this is so important.

Aly Horton  14:55

We recognize that staff members need to align with the school those missions safety and analysis of risk to protect their students. But they’re not doing that with their investments. By divesting, they’re taking power away from industries and corporations that are only perpetuating the climate crisis. divestment is an intersectional way to advocate divesting, not only from fossil fuels, but other carbon-intensive companies is protecting our planet in more ways than people realize that’s going to impact not only our generation but theirs and is currently it is currently impacting everyone on the planet. This movement is only growing because of the unfortunate impacts of climate change. Our movement is only going to continue to grow. 

Aly Horton  15:41

As long as we continue to outreach, to educate and to be passionate about what we’re doing. I would suggest to new organizers to recognize their passion, look to others for help. And since this movement is intersectional there is so much community to be found in this issue because it overarching every issue and every person on this planet. People just need to realize that find that community and push on.

Horace Mo  16:18

Now it’s time for the resilience corner was Tamra Staden. Hi,

Tamara Staton  16:24

I’m Tamra Staton. CCL’s education and resilience coordinator. And this is resilient climatateering through unexpected Climate Connections. This isn’t a series about weather or science or graphs or data, though I do reference some of those from time to time. Instead, it’s a series about things that help us worry less and act more on climate explored through a lens of playful curiosity. Together, we’ll explore how to enjoy what matters so deeply so that we can be as effective as possible for as long as we’re needed. 

Tamara Staton  16:57

Today’s topic is banjos and climate, two seemingly unrelated concepts that I care about deeply. But both of which, at times overwhelming. You and I likely have something in common. We’re both engaged in climate work and we want to do it well. I wonder though, do we also share a love of music, maybe you play an instrument? Maybe you sing, or consider yourself musically inclined in some way. Or maybe like me, you’d love to feel a sense of pride or confidence in your musical ability. Instead, I end up focusing on how I’d like to be better at banjo or taking action on climate.

Tamara Staton  17:44

I would love to be a good banjo player, a great banjo player for that matter. It would be so fun to play Dueling Banjos with my husband on guitar. I dream of kicking it like Kermit in the woods connecting rainbows. Every time I hear banjo in a song, I want to turn it up, Howard, I want to create those sounds, feel my fingers fly, and make people smile and dance. I feel like I’ve been a banjo beginner forever though, dipping every so often into intermediate. I practice my roles. I learned some songs, I get a taste of that competence even and then a dragon of fear and doubt steps in. I think I won’t ever be that good. So it’s really not worth trying. 

Tamara Staton  18:25

I worry sometimes that we won’t ever solve climate change, so my actions aren’t going to matter. fear and doubt paralyze me. What are your dragons? What breathes fire into your face and shuts you down? In the face of good intentions? Is it anger? resentment? Overwhelmed? Maybe. There’s so many obstacles in the world hindering progress on climate action. Why do I also end up face-to-face with obstacles inside me? These feelings are common, and no, I’m not the only one. But why do we feel this way? Sometimes. Maybe it’s the scale of the challenge. Both mastering the banjo and tackling climate change are formidable tasks. The enormity of these challenges can make one’s efforts seem insignificant, leading to feelings of helplessness. 

Tamara Staton  19:16

It could be perfectionism, the desire to achieve perfection can lead to constant self criticism and fear of making mistakes, which can paralyze progress. It might well be impostor syndrome. This is the feeling that one is not as competent as others perceive them to be leading to self doubt and fear of failure. What about the lack of immediate results? In both cases, results are not immediately visible. This delayed gratification can be discouraging, and lead to doubts about the effectiveness of one’s efforts. And there’s also social comparison. constantly comparing oneself to others who may seem more successful or effective, can amplify feelings of inadequacy and fear this especially true in the world of social media. And no doubt, it may have to do with information overload. With climate change the overwhelming amount of information, and the often dire predictions can lead to paralysis by analysis, and a sense of futility.

Tamara Staton  20:22

Does any of this sound familiar to you? Well, knowing about these underlying causes does not make the dragons go away. It does help to lessen their power over me. It affirms when I’m feeling that learning an instrument like the banjo is challenging. Taking on climate change is massive. I’m gonna mess up sometimes and play the wrong note, I might not see the results right away, and may get overwhelmed by the weight of it all. But that’s because I’m human. It’s normal to feel this way. It’s perfectly imperfect, just like you and me.

Tamara Staton  21:02

So in our next episode, I’ll dive into another set of unexpected Climate Connections. So unexpected, in fact that I’m not completely sure which direction to go. 

Tamara Staton  21:12

Do you have any ideas, any Climate Connections you’d like me to dive into? I’m Tamra Staton with Resilience Corner, thank you for listening and for your commitment to progress. To learn more about tools, trainings, and resources for staying strong. Through the climate challenge, check out our resilience hub at CCL Ford slash resilience. And until next month, remember this, find your passion, let it guide you, and you’ll do amazing things for the world.

Erica Valdez  21:48

Thank you, Tamara, do you have questions for Tamara. She’s very happy to consider your resilience questions, conundrums, and suggestions. Do send an email to radio at citizens That’s radio at citizens or text us at 619-512-9646.

Horace Mo  22:08

The resilience corner is made possible with Tamra Staton, education and resilience coordinator for Citizens Climate Education, the resiliency Hub website is CCO


Hi there I’m Peterson Toscano. And our good news story is from South Africa. Actually, I’m coming to you from Limpopo Province in the north of the country. At the moment, I’m at my in-laws house, which is located right in the middle of a game reserve that was recorded outside but I need to keep my eyes open in case a lion or an elephant passes by. And I am not kidding. Horace and Erica, thank you so much for all the hard work you’ve done on this episode, so that I could travel to be here with my family. 

Peterson Toscano  23:23

I arrived in South Africa curious to know how things were going in the energy sector. In June 2020 to two years ago, my husband Glen and I left the country after living here for 18 months. Because not enough energy was generated to supply power to all the homes and businesses in the country. We routinely experienced daily power outages. 

Peterson Toscano  23:48

Here in South Africa, they call the scheduled outages load shedding the state run energy company, Eskom turned off the power for a municipality for two hours at a time. Sometimes they did this four times a day. As you can imagine, Eskom became a dirty word. Everyone I knew loaded an app that alerted us when we could expect the power cuts. 

Peterson Toscano  24:16

But I hoped that loadshedding would soon become a thing of the past. South Africa is rich in sunshine and wind. Many homes like my inlaws already have solar panels or solar water heaters; wind and solar are the smartest ways to get the country off of the unreliable coal powered energy supply. They need to break away from failing power plants and instead turn to cleaner alternatives to fill in the gaps. 

Peterson Toscano  24:45

In 2021, President Cyril Ramaphosa made a groundbreaking announcement. He raised the licensing threshold for private power generation from one megawatt to 100 megawatts. This change opened the door for significant private investment in renewable energy projects. Fast forward to today, June 2024, over 1000 private power generation projects have been registered. These projects contribute nearly 4500 megawatts of new capacity. This surge in private power driven primarily by solar and wind energy is helping to reduce the frequency of power outages and lessen the burden on Eskom. 

Peterson Toscano  25:34

In fact, in over three weeks here, we have not experienced a single bit of loadshedding. This may be in part because I arrived just during the election season. But even after the elections, the power has stayed on. significant investments in renewable energy are transforming the energy landscape in South Africa and bringing cleaner, more reliable power to homes and businesses across the country. 

Peterson Toscano  26:06

Do you have a good news story you want to share from your own community? Let us know about it contact us by email. The email address is radio at citizens That’s radio at citizens

Peterson Toscano  26:31

Over the last month many of you have shared our posts on social media and more people have joined us on social media. Here are some people and organizations that have shown us some love. Thank you to Robert D. Evans, Pete Marsh Bill Nash 1.5, EG Hibdon, Mats Söderlund, Justin D’Atri, and last month’s guest, Rob Hopkins. Earthbased.Soul, FCWC, and  CCL Alameda, Alaska,   And the CCL Young Conservative Caucus. Thank you so much for reposting and sharing our content with your followers. 

Peterson Toscano  27:15

And we welcome some new social media followers. Hello to Mary Francis, Wendy Bayer and Bill Buffington. You can follow us on Twitter, Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook and TikTok. We also have a listener voicemail line where you can leave us a message that we could play on the next episode. The number is 619-512-9646 plus one if you’re calling from outside the USA, that number again 619-512-9646. And now back to Erica and Horace and I think I’m about to go for a game drive. See you next month.

Horace Mo  28:08

Thank you for joining us for episode 96 of Citizens Climate Radio. 

Erica Valdez  28:13

If you like what you hear, and you want to support the work that we do, visit To learn how you can make a tax-deductible contribution. 

Horace Mo  28:23

Here at a Citizens Climate Education will want you to be effective in the climate work you do. So we provide training, local group meetings and many resources. They’re all designed to help you build the confidence and skills needed to pursue climate solutions. Find out how you can learn and grow and connect with others who are engaged in a meaningful work. Visit CCL That’s CCO

Erica Valdez  28:55

We want to hear your feedback about this episode. After you listen feel free to fill out a short survey. You will find a link to the survey in our show notes or just email me radio at Citizens Climate Citizens Climate Radio is written and produced by Peterson Toscano, Horace Moe and Eric about this other technical support from Ricky Bradley and Brett cease social media assistance from Flannery Winchester and moral support from Madeline Para.

Horace Mo  29:21

The music on today’s show comes from Please share Citizens Climate Radio with your friends and colleagues. You can find Citizens Climate Radio wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, feel free to connect with other listeners suggest program ideas and respond to programs in the Citizens Climate Radio Facebook group from x previously know on Twitter, Instagram, LinkedIn, or TikTok at climate change podcast. Visit CCL To see our show notes and find links to our guests. Citizens Climate Radio. He’s a project of Citizens Climate Education